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 Aw.. shit. 
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Post Re: Aw.. shit.
fluffy wrote:
joshex wrote:
fluffy wrote:
joshex wrote:
only one user can write to any one object per frame.

Simply mediate writes and queue them as needed. A mediator user accepts write commands and organizes them into a single write or write queue as needed to prevent conflicts and performs the writes on behalf of the users. The only tricky part is scripting the algorithm to determine which writes can be combined and which writes must be queued.


then the conflict comes when 2 objects simultaneously attempt to write to the mediator. The problem is still there it just moved to another object/user.

I talked about that in the spoiler section, it's why random items are lost when attempting to transfer them to something like say a shop, and why sometimes your attack doesn't hit anything but expires, or why sometimes rarely your message is not received by the game and you get no error.

it's rare because it depends on frames, there are 60 frames per second the chance that any two or more given players will make requests of the same object at the same 1/60th of a second seems rather absurd and obscure, but leave players at it for long enough and you'd be surprised.

I scripted the UI yesterday, it works but it's not looping enough, that's ok though because I can trigger it with more communication when the requested object is done handling a user it'll send a message to all objects "Next!" which will trigger the code again, because right now the code only loops 2 times then cuts off probably due to a logic brick and code timing conflict.

The mediator needs to have a queued input that's asynchronous to the frame rate of the rest of the thing.

I'm using the Source engine as an example here but here goes nothing.

The FPS of the program is about states of the database. The database can be anything, all programs can be logically reduced to manipulating bits in a database. Each frame the program attempts to sanity check the database; this is the purpose of frames. Impossible data or anything not passing the sanity check (even if it's not impossible) throw an error; error handling then decides how much of a problem that is. The mediator would need to be a thread on its own only being asked or only giving output once per frame. It would need to receive input on a buffer or otherwise spooled input. Think stdout or any string concatenation.

Source uses server and client FPS very differently. On the server side the FPS determines how many times per second the server solidifies the data into a state of the game. On the client side the FPS determines how many times the data in the client is used to calculate the geometry sent to the discrete graphics processor. It sounds like the problem you're having is basically that the game is using a blocking code that's not threaded and this code handles the data once per frame. I don't know the shape of your data but if the data you want to manipulate needs to be more multitasking friendly I suggest moving that data to a place where it can have manipulations queued using if_not_changed_since frame count/time stamp checks and on fail retry loops, or using a handler that performs this function and optionally combines manipulations that don't conflict using a lookup table or bitmap of allowed and compatible changes, queuing the rest as needed.


This is what I was going to do. but my long winded post says all the reasons why I didn't do it. I kinda did it, then realized that while I was typing up the code and testing it it really wasn't doing what I was hoping it would do and was honestly far too much work for the outcome. So I simplified.

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Wed Jul 13, 2016 12:30 am
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Post Re: Aw.. shit.
I saw a flowchart on how to write good code on xkcd. It's pretty much what you've described with a healthy dose of satire. My honest experience is that there are always and only two ways to do something: the right way and again.

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Wed Jul 13, 2016 9:22 am
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Post Re: Aw.. shit.
fluffy wrote:
I saw a flowchart on how to write good code on xkcd. It's pretty much what you've described with a healthy dose of satire. My honest experience is that there are always and only two ways to do something: the right way and again.


Image
:l

:confused

I are not smart.

... it sure gets results, though!

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Wed Jul 13, 2016 8:29 pm
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Post Re: Aw.. shit.
Image
http://xkcd.com/844/

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In just under one-thousand eight-bit bytes I have to confer some glorious shrine to myself by means of text, images, hyper links, embeded flash compositions and possibly formatting. I could abuse this easily. Ten hour clips on youtube embeded in a single vertical stack. Multi-megapixel long transparent GIFs causing scrollbar hell. Nuero-linguistic programs that fuck your mind like a fresh squid. Eye raping color schemes using ascii full-width blocks. Images or links to images of things that can not be unseen. Anything called "epilepsy" dot SWF. This is what I want to do. I am not a good person. I just know that would be a flagrant display of disrespect. I'll wait until I can get away with it.
NOW IN GLORIOUS TODD A.O.!
fluffco™ LLC takes no responsibility for anything, ever, at all, under any circumstances and is entirely fictional outside Colorado.


Wed Jul 13, 2016 8:43 pm
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Post Re: Aw.. shit.
!SSECCUS

I have 100% backwards success in the UI test now.

what do I mean backwards? the experiment is being triggered by the UI object instead of user requests, so it's exactly backwards. but I have 20 users that each subtract 1 and only 1 from a property on the UI while each taking their own turn because they are picked one by one by the UI.

so it's a cheat then?

no actually it's good for AoE. AoE is always backwards from singular attacks. in a singular attack the player announces what target it will effect[then UI], in AoE the player spawns an object, if enemy objects are hit by or are with-in a certain distance to the object then they report in to the Player as done above.

so what did the above experiment simulate? it simulated 20 users spawning one AoE attack each, dealing 1 damage each to one object.

how long did it take the 20 users? 2 seconds, an average of 10 users a second, which given 60 frames a second is a frame waste of 5 frames per user, totaling 50 frames of waste for communication with all users.

however even on a server where one map has a max player allotment of 100 users, the chance that more than 10 users will hit one object with an AoE at any given second is slim. even so I should try to make the frame waste for communication as little as possible. I can probably cut it to 4 or 3 communication statements where as right now there's like 8 so I should be able to cut it in half, which will mean around 25 frames of waste per second and 35 users able to be instanced per second. that's over 1/3rd the map limit for players and well over the number of CPU enemies that can effect a player at any given time (20, most MMOs limit it to 15).

most MMOs put the player map limit at around 30 to 50? CoH was 40 users if I remember correctly.

However that's not counting pets as objects which can damage, most games count pets as an extension of their owner in order to easily transfer all pet attacks through the owner to the target thereby gaining statistical benefits from the owner in the process. In this way by treating them as part of the player however, the player and their pets cannot attack the same target on the same frame unless they're attacks are time synced and they're damage is added together into one damage value which requires the player to have advanced user instancing of their own pet objects. it's not a bad system, if fact I might do it to save the number of users that could attack one target at a time from multiplying by the number of pets any one player can have.

in city of heroes the max number of battle capable pets was let me see, 10 to 12 or 14(if counting pets that can be taken control of in the environment such as turrets or giant robots) if I remember correctly, and only if you were on a Mastermind archetype character otherwise most users got from 3 to 5 pets max. still if each pet were it's own object sending attacks to targets, imagine a map of 100 players with 14 pets each all attacking the same target. that's 1500 attacking objects. there are likely to be way too many Users attacking a target per frame to be handled within one second even at 35 users a second. luckily Attack Recharge Time and attack casting time(activation time)helps with that. it keeps the spam down and keeps each attack from each user spaced to at least a minimum of 3 seconds, but may be as much as 20 seconds.

anyways,yeah 35 users a second should be ample if I take proper precautions.

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Wed Jul 13, 2016 11:08 pm
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Post Re: Aw.. shit.
gosh I'm lazy I could have had this UI thing fully coded in the test game today but I... went out and then came back and looked at news all day.

I always have so many projects. sometimes my projects spawn awesome other projects. but those are just for laughs usually.

so. What do I have to do tomorrow? program the 3rd UI message and what dos for it. it's just a simple 'I'm a blah' followed by 'ok then -1 from the total', then the next message which is exactly that 'Next'. it tells all the others to report in if they are not Done.

aftar that I will work on teh background to finish it up.

so much to do lol.. still have the text to do.

Edit: Never mind, did it tonight, now I'll have to give the code a good follow through tomorrow to make sure everything is necessary and in order and that all the triggers are needed and correct.

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Mon Jul 18, 2016 8:41 am
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Post Re: Aw.. shit.
the property MyNum was not filled in.

this will be confusing, because blender handles object numbers in reverse order (highest to lowest). So I'll have to do some backwards math.

shouldn't be too much trouble I guess.

0 is an easy starting point to count up from, but when there is no max number of objects it's hard to count down.. why? why must it count down from highest to lowest?

oh yeah because I flipped them, blender handled them in the correct order sending the lowest number to the message sensor first, but then it became the last message on the list as new entries came in and I asked for message[0]

I can fix the order if I switch it around by doing: get message[sensor.getFrameMessageCount() - 1] that will get the last message on the list with the lowest number versus the highest number. that way when it comes to the MyNum property I can just pull it from the object name. Or I could have them assign themselves a number as they are processed by the UI. yeah that's better.

Edit: Done. MyNum is now filled in by the UI as the UI picks each object "I am the Chosen one!"

Edit again: everything in the code seems in order etc. The only thing missing is the Set/Reset Message,

'Set' will be done once on load (starting the game) if the area was not started/completed so there will have to be a save file which lists levels and either NotStarted, Started, or Complete.

'Reset' ignores the save file and resets the board if you step on the reset switch.

as with all save files they are easily hack-able especially when the game is in source. but that's shameful to cheat to win. it's a game of probability, math and logic. cheating means you are bad at those things.

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Mon Jul 18, 2016 6:58 pm
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Post Re: Aw.. shit.
Tieing up the loose ends on the interactive objects, Locks are finished, gotta make a key and the reset switch. working on other blocks. special blocks not yet made and special [LEVEL CONTROL] spawners not made yet.

after that I can do some simple graphics, not much is needed.

Coding mostly complete on the test game. in fact I think other than the reset switch and special blocks and level control spawners, everything is coded.

I mean I just be able to re arrange things and run it and it should work now (after some possible minimalistic error cleanup like using OBObjectname instead of Objectname)

I want to test it tonight but that's a no. I rambo coded it. and that means Though it looks logically done I may have forgotten something.. OH yes.. I did. I forgot to tell the UI what "Flagged" and "UnFlagged" mean. better do that now rambo code style.

rambo code complete, other errors noticed during rambo code and fixed. Will review tomorrow before swapping objects to new layers, making the reset switch and testing. if success then I'll do more graphics. if fail I'll do something else on my list of to-dos and go back to the test game at a later time.

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Mon Jul 18, 2016 10:57 pm
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Post Re: Aw.. shit.
wtf eh? I have a working game engine that needs to be debugged. why not do it and build levels and run a patreon thang?

https://patreon.com/preview/d209414197a ... 8c6341aa77

this patreon page is mine but is not active yet. please tell me what you think.

Edit:

link updated.

I think it may just need pictures.

I should collected pictures of game models and textures I've already made and use those in a collage sort of scene with pictures of game stuff and test files and scripts I've made.

thats now on teh todo list.

Edit 2: the link is updated I'm fully satisfied with the text, goals and rewards now.

onto images, will need to make a banner for each level, and a main project image banner.

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Wed Jul 20, 2016 11:53 pm
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Post Re: Aw.. shit.
Updated with reward banners.

https://patreon.com/preview/ba05531941c ... a1dd1427a3

edit: made a main banner. Tired of making custom graphics for the campaign. slapped an image from the animation I made for my gf's bachelors final project for the user image.

Done. I await FH peer review.

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Sat Jul 23, 2016 10:56 pm
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Post Re: Aw.. shit.
FH PINGAS REVIEW.

See that green character in the banner? Note the lines around it, like a badly ripped hentai character from early Yom-style sex kitten games? You need to hide that border.

It imparts a sense of sloppiness that makes people think 'what an amateur!' and gtfo faster than a sjw gtfoing from the "twirling maiden", a popular strip club in downtown FH City.

"Bare with me because I'm only a one person indie developer and this project may take a while to complete." Aside from the typo of 'bare' instead of bear, this comes off as a level 1 of self entitlement.

You're asking for help - not making a case for business. Be a bit more casual.

"1: submit game ideas to add into the game. (if they conflict with other users ideas or are too time consuming to make they may be simplified or put in in a minor capacity)
2: the finished game project. (donors will be allowed to download the finished project)
3: for larger donors you can get your name, picture or some other reference to you in the game.
4: tutorials and test files.
5: memorabilia"

You seem to be forgetting basic formatting. Try this.
1: Submit game ideas to add into the game. (if they conflict with other users ideas or are too time consuming to make they may be simplified or put in in a minor capacity)

2: The finished game project. (donors will be allowed to download the finished project)
3: For larger donors you can get your name, picture or some other reference to you in the game.

4: Guidebooks and test files. (don't slip off the tutorial!)

5: Memorabilia

and so on.

Again, at the last section, break up that wall of text.

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Mon Jul 25, 2016 7:46 pm
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Post Re: Aw.. shit.
talked with yom about my patreon page and he gave a review. after that:

fluffy and yom hold a conversation about extreme commenting with the utilization of ASCII art to catch the reader's attention.

then I mopped the floor for the entire day.

then I returned:

(11:55:12) joshex: lol, I should do some things like that in the game lol.
(11:55:25) joshex: fixed the banner (am in the process of uploading it
(11:56:16) joshex: will fix the text later.
(12:00:12) YomToxic: You get what I'm saying, though?
(12:00:26) YomToxic: Make it less like a business presentation and more like a casual idea pitching.
(12:00:44) YomToxic: ... and you kinda need to give some info on WHAT YOUR GAME ACTUALLY IS.

Message received!

Edit: patreon has a glitch sometimes, regardless if you saved; if you change the main explanation text it erases your goals and rewards, luckily I had foreseen this possibility and copied everything to a text file. I will need to update that text file before moving forwards.

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Tue Jul 26, 2016 4:33 am
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Post Re: Aw.. shit.
         __,.r 、,.-、_       ⊂[[二ニニ=- Oh god, how did this get here?
     ,. ''"´〉、」__,.!__--「`ヘ_
   ./  「`ヽ,.-‐ァ´`7ヽハ_7      ⊂[[二ニニ=- I am not good with computer.
  /   />、/´ / / / ./^i
  l  ∠」´ >/  rrメ、レ/!イ/ |       ⊂[[二ニニ=- What even is happening?
  i  /ヽァ'´ /! |_ソ  / ハ i 
  /`〈ヽ∠,イ´ハ."   〈イ/レ'        ⊂[[二ニニ=- Is this valid code?
 ヘ  ヽ、 i   `くゝ、 /、_
  レヘ/ヽヘハ_,.r7'´ ̄`ゝ-'、______        ⊂[[二ニニ=- How I mine for Sakuya?
       r/ {〈     ト7    ̄ ̄ ̄`'=-、_
       /ト、ヽゝ、_____,.イン ̄ ̄ ̄ ̄`'ー-‐-'  ⊂[[二ニニ=- Ok, this comment actually has a point.
   ,. -‐'" /`i,メ::::r'/   〉
  〈,r_,.-、j´   く^ヽイヽ/i、           ⊂[[二ニニ=- Get it? Because of the daggers?
      ,へ、__「7⌒ド>、/\
      _,.>-'":::::::::/|:::ヽ  `'ー-、、    ⊂[[二ニニ=- But really, it's to make the following, otherwise unremarkable code easier to find/remember.
     rく:::::::/:::::::::ヘ_」::::Yヽ、  ヽi7
    Lヽイ:::::::::::::::::::::i:::::::ヽンヽ_,.イ/  ⊂[[二ニニ=- You see, that code initializes variables that might get called for but never set.
     ヽく>、r、::::::::/:::::::::i:::ゝ_r'
       ^'r7、二rニニ7イ--=|    ⊂[[二ニニ=- Without this following set of conditional statements the script will throw (get it? sorry) errors or trip and fall.
         /   /   |   |
       /   /    |  |   ⊂[[二ニニ=- While adorable, this isn't a desirable feature of a production script and needs to be fixed.
      rへ,_/       |  |
     /7、_/       〉r-」
    ト、__/         ! >__.!
 ....:::::::!,__,/:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::\__」:::::........
  ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

It might not look quite right due to the font.

_________________
In just under one-thousand eight-bit bytes I have to confer some glorious shrine to myself by means of text, images, hyper links, embeded flash compositions and possibly formatting. I could abuse this easily. Ten hour clips on youtube embeded in a single vertical stack. Multi-megapixel long transparent GIFs causing scrollbar hell. Nuero-linguistic programs that fuck your mind like a fresh squid. Eye raping color schemes using ascii full-width blocks. Images or links to images of things that can not be unseen. Anything called "epilepsy" dot SWF. This is what I want to do. I am not a good person. I just know that would be a flagrant display of disrespect. I'll wait until I can get away with it.
NOW IN GLORIOUS TODD A.O.!
fluffco™ LLC takes no responsibility for anything, ever, at all, under any circumstances and is entirely fictional outside Colorado.


Wed Jul 27, 2016 8:29 pm
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Post Re: Aw.. shit.
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WISDOM OF THE AEONS.

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Tue Aug 02, 2016 2:01 pm
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Post Re: Aw.. shit.
YomToxic wrote:
Image
WISDOM OF THE AEONS.


very well, as discussed, the adventure of mr. cube will happen. I may decide to put in the base character I have, and animate him for certain things and maybe give him an outfit. but I think that's stretching the work load before I get monies into something tasking.

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Tue Aug 02, 2016 7:00 pm
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